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UCI plunges in world university rankings
October 11th, 2009, 7:17 am · 36 Comments · posted by Gary Robbins, science writer-editor
Times Higher Education in London annually produces a list of what it regards as the world's top 200 colleges and universities.
UC Irvine’s status takes a hit in new ranking of the world’s top colleges and universities, which is produced annually by Times Higher Education (THE), a widely-cited London-based magazine. The so-called World University Rankings show Irvine sliding from 132nd place in 2008 to to 161st this year. The drop was part of a general trend in which numerous American schools slipped in the rankings while Asian institutions rose.
The new rankings drew immediate criticism in academia, where people said the rankings are overly reliant on reputation rather than a fully quantitative measure of excellence. But its also true that many schools publicize such rankings when they do well. UCI, for example, regularly crows about the fact that US News and World Report considers it to be one of the best public universities in the country.
UCI did not respond to a request about the THE rankings.
THE’s ranking are based on a variety of factors, ranking from how often a school’s researchers are cited by other scientists and engineers to staff-to-student ratio to the number of international students a school has. (Complete explanation of criteria.) The rankings also are based on “peer review,” or what hundreds of scholars think of specific institutions, a yardstick that has drawn criticism from some quarters, include Inside Higher Ed, a respected news organization. The rankings overlook the fact that American scientists continue to dominate the Nobel Prizes.
THE has conducted the rankings since 2004. Here’s how UCI has ranked:
| Year | Ranking |
|---|---|
| 2009 | 161 |
| 2008 | 132 |
| 2007 | 140 |
| 2006 | 198 |
| 2005 | Didn’t make list |
| 2004 | Didn’t make list |
THE largely ignores such criticism and is blunt in its overview of the higher education, saying in its intro to this year’s rankings: ” While the US still has by far the most institutions in the top 200, with a total of 54, it has lost five institutions from the top 100 and four have dropped out of the top 200 altogether.
“The country’s decline comes amid improved showings by institutions in Japan, Hong Kong, South Korea and Malaysia.
“Philip Altbach, director of the Centre for Higher Education at Boston College in the US, says several factors are behind the surges by Asian institutions.
“These countries have invested heavily in higher education in recent years, and this is reflected in the improved quality in their top institutions,” he says. “They have also attempted to internationalise their universities by hiring more faculty from overseas … this helps to improve their visibility globally.
“These universities have also stressed the importance of their professors publishing in international journals, which has no doubt increased the visibility of their research.”
Other UCI stories …
- UCI resumes classes amid deep financial problems
- Creationists may hand out ’special edition’ of Darwin’s ‘Origins’ at UCI
- UCI offers free robotic therapy to some stroke patients
- UCI will stop using rats in 2 biology classes
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36 Comments
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The methodology for these rankings is really goofy. For example, UC Irvine has a 99 for citations per faculty (which is probably the only legitimate measurement in this ranking). Compare that measurement with other schools on the list and you’ll see it is easily competitive with the top 10 schools in the world.
Meanwhile, it suffers in international students (because it’s a public school, and the high out of state costs are always going to make it difficult to attract internationals. It also suffers in its Academic Peer Review (which comprises 40% of the entire ranking and is basically the opinion of some academic about some school which is not even on their continent).
Take a look at the results if you don’t believe me: some truly fantastic schools are ranked far behind some obviously less spectacular ones.
They are just jealous.
If schools would stop pandering to these magazines they would go away. Stop advertising when you do well and release a statement rejecting the magazine’s credibility every issue, not just times when you do poorly.
Probably linked to the very large international student body they have. They have to accomodate the non-native English speakers now or lose funding.
Ray that is a really ignorant comment you just made. If you are admitted to a university, language is not a concern. After all for none English speaking applicants there is a language competency test to take paid by the applicant . Universities are not charities. Now stop making ridiculous comments and crawl back to the hole you came from
A fairly recent article in the OC Register reported that UCI had decided to give admissions preference to international students because they would have to pay higher tuition.
I have gone to class with non-native English speakers who passed these tests but could barely converse at a high school level but still graduate.
Universities are not charities but they are becoming businesses.
Ray: UCI has absolutely not said they would give preference to international students because they pay higher fees.
Sorry Gary, I saw the article with my own eyes some time ago now. I will leave it there.
Maybe if tuition and fees go high enough, UCI will rise to 132nd again, when there are no students left who can afford a higher education
These types of rankings are all silly, and the methods can always be called into question. Are we ranking quality of undergraduate education? Graduate education? Quality of research? Overall, or in specific disciplines? Accessibility? Affordability? The mind reels…
**But, sour grapes aside, the quote in the next-to-last paragraph says it all to me: “These countries have invested heavily in higher education in recent years…” While the US in general, and California in particular, continue to invest less on education at all levels. Classes are cut, staff is furloughed, construction and maintenance is delayed or canceled, and students have to borrow heavily to afford it all.
Jim: With the exception of the budget crisis this year, the overall funding of most colleges and universities has been at record levels, partly due to the growth of California.
“Ray” is wrong. All international students must possess a high TOFEL (Test Of English As A Foreign Language) score to be admitted to the University of California. Perhaps ‘Ray’ never attended an institution of higher learning? Certainly he would have known this fact if he had. Pity.
In reality, ‘Ray’, international students are vital to the success of a university. They provide a much needed diversity to the entire university community and help keep tuition lower for locally born students. Without the major financial contribution of these students, tuition would be much higher for all students.
Try to get your facts straight before you let your xenophobia run amok.
I have attended the UC system. In my experience non-native English speakers contributed and participated the least in class discussions.
I think your comments on University funding are totally correct. However, I think there are too many foreign students these days taking up limited space that is supposed to go to American students.
We just need a better balance and more concern for our own in these hard times.
Ray: I sense that you don’t have a good grasp on UCI’s enrollment. Most research universities in this country have trouble recruiting American students in some disciplines, notably engineering. Irvine isn’t giving preference to international students at the expense of qualified American students. Indeed, some of the professional engineering societies have been working hard to build interest among Americans in engineering.
This is the most absurd comment I have seen yet in the OC Register. Applications are a record level. Admit rate is at an alltime low for almost all research universities. Very, very few universities recruit at an undergraduate level for any major. Students don’t declare a major usually until their second year. Even at a graduate level there is incredible demand to get into research institutions for engineering and scienc majors.
This is the first time I have ever commented here after reading for years, but your statement Gary is just totally wrong.
Cardcounter: you are mistaken. UCI enrollment statistics show that over 80% of new freshmen have declared a major going in, at least at the school level (Engineering, Humanities, Social Science, Biological Science, etcetera). While they don’t recruit for specific majors at this level, I think that it can make a difference in admissions decisions. My son was admitted to UCI last spring, although he ended up going elsewhere. He was at about the 80th percentile at a school with a lot of AP students. His test scores were OK, but not spectacular. I believe that his declared major of Engineering might have been a contributing factor in his admission.
At the graduate level, I agree with you that admission to at least some Engineering majors is very competitive at UCI.
I’m shocked that USC even made it on to the list. Outside of Southern California and football circles, it barely registers.
Shocked: USC is highly respected and highly ranked in many disciplines, including business, engineering, film, communications and gerontology. I don’t have the specific figure handy, but USC brings in more than $400 million in research funding each year. The school has an international reputation.
I finished a master’s degree in engineering @ USC in 2007. Almost all (80-90%) of my classmates were from China and India.
You may want to revise your statement.
The same people deciding the rankings must have decided on the Nobel Peace Prize.
I commend the University on making the list. UCI is clearly a world class institution and a local treasure.
Americans got a lot of Nobel prizes but the Nobel prize winners are mostly came from other countries, or the 2nd generation Americans
However, the readers normally ask for the deportation of any one
who has the last name with the non-American root. A lot of readers
are stupid, ignorant to think US is the leading country in the world
without knowing the troubles that American has
1. The high school graduates are not efficient in math, and science
compare to other countries
2. The federal debts are excessive and continue to go up with one
bail out after another
3. US manufacturing lost the edges in the last many years, and
Americans consume more than produce as well as create
more political fighting, bipartisan arguments to add layer after
layer of bureaucracies in policies and laws
4. Fraud, waste are everywhere, so soon you will see US as the
3rd world country with nothing to be proud about
5. The US political system is killing this country, look at California
budget to know the real situation
6. The health care cost the most and it is still not the best in the
world thanks to the excessive compensation packages to
health insurance and pharmaceutical company execs.
7. Illegal immigrants are treated like KING with all the benefits
that no other country can match
James,
I agree with some of your points, but there are some that lack perspective.
1. Most U.S. high schools educate almost everyone living within certain boundaries, regardless of academic ability. In many countries, high schools are segregated by ability or achievement level. Comparisons are often between U. S. high schools and the higher-ranking schools in foreign countries, so they are comparing apples to oranges.
4. While fraud is deplorable, it exists everywhere.
7. Not true. Many developed nations treat illegal immigrants a lot better than the U.S. does.
Is there an over all increase in sitings by Asian universities siting Asian researchers? (as the increase seems to be Asian univerisities)
Curious as many come to UCI for some of their education.
Ray:
It’s not true that international students don’t speak good English. They simply speak English with an accent. And their written English is probably more correct (although in a formalized manner) than typical America-born students.
And don’t forget that they already speak and write perfectly in their mother tongue.
I have a good perspective because I was an international student in Montreal 40 years ago, where I had to use formal English at McGill University (THE rank 18) and casual French in town. My American-born daughter speaks English and some Vietnamese. My American-born son, who is 5 years younger, speaks only English.
Both of them attend UCI. My wife insists on paying all their expenses in the Asian tradition, rather than let them apply for student loans.
My daughter graduated Magna Cum Laude in biology. My wife insisted on putting her through medical school, but she got a job instead. My wife is now furious, calling my daughter a drop-out and refusing to talk to her directly (making me a go-between).
My son knows early where the money is. He’s majoring in business.
I studied engineering and has been clinging to the profession ever since. But neither my daughter nor my son considers education (and career) as a life mission to kill themselves with. They want to take it easy (probably like most American youngsters).
That might explain why American education is not so competitive. But that’s OKay. I’ve seen lots of Asian students kill themselves after flunking exams, and I certainly don’t wish that for my own children.
When you enjoy a high standard of living, you naturally don’t try as hard as hungrier people.
In no way does UCI hold a light to New Mexico Tech for a degree in engineering, science, and computer science.
Check it out at nmt.edu. Not everybody qualifies to be accepted. And, majority of the students finish a four year degree in four years!
To be included in world top 200 list itself is a great achievement.
It seems that we will have to add a new corolary to the Godwin’s Law for the OCR comments. Mention “illegals” at the drop of a hat and you lose the argument.
Editor’s Note: Kevin’s remarks deleted for being off topic. The story is about THE’s rankings of the world’s best universities.
As for Richard’s remark, how can you rise in the rankings if you have fewer and fewer students?
Spence:Most of your post is very interesting. But Irvine has a lot of international students, mostly in engineering and computer science.
Yawn…(native)
Cardcounter: You didn’t read the article. I didn’t re-rank UCI. The THE did. And as the story notes, many Asian institutions are investing huge amounts of money in their universities, which has allowed some of them to climb the list. I welcome your comment. But you really need to read what’s being said before you comment.
My response was directed specifically toward your statement that research universities have trouble recruiting American students in some disciplines, notably engineering. There are an enormous amount of highly qualified Americans that don’t get into research universities because of the intense competition.
Try to focus Gary. My response was to your comment, not the article.
Cardcounter: Thanks for writing. Your analysis isn’t right on this particular story. The IEEE and various engineering societies in the U.S. have been trying very hard to get more American students to enter engineering. They’re not having much luck. The same is true in some areas of computer science and the biological sciences. International students are not taking spots that would go to qualified American students.
Who would recommend engineering as a profession to a young American? Constant lay-offs, contract positions with no benefits, outsourcing and salaries declining. This is the perfect job for the upwardly mobile in India and China. Not recommended as a career in the United States.
Can you give me the name of one American research university that is NOT turning away qualified students?
Most half-decent research universities have an admit rate of less than 25% which means they are rejecting over 75% of all applicants.
As a 4th year mechanical engineering student, i went into engineering for a variety of reasons. It’s one of the most flexible careers on the job market, you can practically get into any discipline with an engineering degree.
If you look at CEOs of Fortune 500 companies, something like 30% of them have engineering degrees. You can also work almost anywhere in the world, an engineering degree is international, as opposed to a law degree (you can be a lawyer in one country but not legally in another).
Engineering is also one of the most stable careers and in reality is a job of the future with the intense development of alternative energy and medical equipment. Lastly, its the major with the best average starting salary for a Bachelors degree, so you are literally getting a bang for your buck.
So please refine your future comments before posting them